True, we as fans have very little say, but I feel our club could represent themselves better, not by being un-constructive and difficult, but by working closely with the rfl and where necessary putting our case forward in a stronger fashion.



Part of this is no doubt probably down to a lack of CEO and strong leadership. Hopefully the appointment of a general manager will go some way to rectifying this.



- Unfair suspensions last season (maybe five of our players deserved the bans - but they weren't fighting their own shadows!)

- Losing Julien Rinaldi because we followed the RFL's rules to the letter on overseas players. A rule that other clubs didn't follow. Instead they complained and got a clause added.

- Having the fewest penalties awarded to us in two consecutive seasons (and not getting off to the best of starts this year)



Meanwhile Hull proceed to the Challenge Cup final despite fielding an ineligible player for two consecutive rounds, promised new stadiums from other clubs show very little signs of actually materialising and how many more times do St Helens need to commit a “minor” breech of the salary cap before someone at Red Hall notices its becoming a habit?

Clarky has got this right. Ive been saying this for years and any one who has been to see teams like Saints at home bully (sorry infuence

) the ref into giving penalties for offside or forward passes will understand the way it works. We managed it ourselves against Wigan a few weeks ago for offside. We gave a big shout after we all thought they were offside at the PTB which the ref ignored then on the next PTB the crowd screamed at a higher level and the ref gave it - Penalty to the crowd IMO. This offside business, is very subjective. High tackles are often blown for which are often marginal but a big scream from the crowd often works as i think the ref doesnt want people to say he missed it.

In a perfect world all teams would get a fair call from the ref but it isnt a fair world. So much in RL is subjective and if we are to be a success we need to get more vocal over these things at games. Penalties win games and we need to even up the calls if we want the points.

Anderson at Saints last year after a defeat publicly criticised Smith who was the ref for that particular match, and he never reffed them again for the remainder of the season. Coincidence possibly





This year we get each ref 3 times I believe, so it will be interesting to see the stats at the end of the season. It would also be interesting to study the trends on each ref. Im sure Cummings does this ....yeah

Does our small crowd also prevent us from giving away penalties? Fair play award two seasons ago. our crowds increased a little last season and we didn't win it. This year our crowds are practically nothing and were top of the fair play league again



Mirror mirror on the wall who is the fairest team of all.

Ok I'm bringing my STrepsils tonight so I can do my bit! 14th man in the East Stand!! FORWARD!! OFFSIDE!!

I've been as vocal as anyone against referees but I've always said that it's not what we get penalised for, it's what other teams get away with that's the problem.

Last night I was in line with a blatant Hull forward pass, the touch judge who was also right in line saw it, started to raise his flag and then bottled it. It wasn't a line ball, or a flat pass, it was very clearly forward, and he'd quite clearly seen it. Now if that had been at Knowsley Road, and a touchie had deliberately turned a blind eye to a blatant forward pass against Saints I reckon the crowd would have burst the spineless little cretin's ear drums for what is effectively cheating.

The TJ will never raise his flag for a forward pass-ever

if harlequins get less penalties than most teams and are top of the fair play league (give away less penalties) maybe the refs in front of low crowds just let the game amble along with no fear of controversy

Sunday morning I caught the end of the re-run of the game on Sky, Phil Clarke and Stevo were brilliant, full of praise towards the club and their strategy of Local youth development. I think Phil's a secret Quins fan.................................

Not so much a Quins fan, more he's very pro on developing young British payers and then giving them a chance in the first team to help us get up to Ozzie standard. Quins are one team who are really doing it rather tahn just 'talking'.

I think PC will stay a Wigan fan, but I think we must be second





I have to say well done to Stevo as well, met him in the Kings bar after the game, and he was happy to talk, and he kept telling me to not give up and keep supporting the game, which I will of course, it was just nice hearing him say it.